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Frieda
Hi all,
How am I supposed to play this?
Thanks!

Frieda
31 Responses
Posted: March 7, 2018
Last Comment: March 19, 2018
Replies

Frieda
Posted: March 19, 2018
Yes Fabiano thanks. Iíll keep that in mind!

Fabiano Formiga de Carvalho
Posted: March 18, 2018
scordatura
https://www.thestrad.com/artists/viola-tailpiece-snaps-during-concert/7635.article

Frieda
Posted: March 18, 2018
Working on phrasing now, so many possibilities... what a challenge!

Sonia Lancaster
Posted: March 18, 2018
 The notation at the beginning is for the tuning.
The notes tell you how to tune the four strings and the sharps/naturals tell you where the fingers go. So here the F and G on the E String are played sharpened, as is the C on the A string. Other occurrences of F, G And C are played as naturals. Note that with the new tuning the fingered notes may not be their actual pitch.

Sonia

Barb Wimmer
Posted: March 18, 2018
Guessing

A and e play then play a and e together. Like two notes

The low one first

Frieda
Posted: March 18, 2018
Hi all, saw my teacher yesterday and received more explanation about scordatura. I also was not sure what to do with the F,C and G sharps and the F, C and G naturals as indicated and the answer was simpleÖ you have to play the F, C and G sharp when you meet them on the same line where they were placed at the beginning of the staff. The same path to follow for the F, C and G naturalÖ you play them natural when you meet them on the same line where they were placed at the beginning of the staff. That means that you must be very concentrated while playingÖ is it a high F, play it sharp, is it a lower F, play it naturel. 
It keeps me occupied but Iím a great fan of Biber!!!


Frieda
Posted: March 16, 2018
Ok Sonia! And tomorrow Iíll see my teacher... more info will follow!

Sonia Lancaster
Posted: March 13, 2018
Thanks Frieda. It may be beyond my capabilities. I also looked at the Sonata no 4, tuning strings to AEAE. Wow how different the violin sounds. I can totally understand why Scordatura is done. Here is a video of it https://youtu.be/XQNfsMrAqS8 I can manage some of the beginning. 

Keep us up to date with how youíre doing Frieda...

Frieda
Posted: March 13, 2018
Hi Sonia, good luck! I canít wait to hear you play this piece!

Sonia Lancaster
Posted: March 12, 2018
These are gorgeous. I am going to try the Passacaglia. This is mesmerising https://youtu.be/sgcR183f8gA

Thank you for posting this up. Iíd never heard of this way of tuning. The passacaglia doesnít have to be tuned any different (unless you use baroque tuning)

Sonia

Frieda
Posted: March 11, 2018
Yes Elke... they are breathtaking. I donít know why my teacher gave me this, as they are too difficult for me. But I am so glad he did... I enjoy every minute of listening to them... 

Elke Meier
Posted: March 11, 2018
I just discovered the recording by Andrew Manze of the Rosary Sonatas - WOW, they ARE beautiful!!

Barbara Habel
Posted: March 9, 2018
I do not know whether I am off topic here. But to me the first thought was how important it would be to me to rotate the left hand elbow to the front of the violin after fingering the chord - to easily reach the E string with your fingers for the following notes.

Inge Black
Posted: March 9, 2018
This is interesting.  It reminds me of transposing instruments where music is written for the transposing instrument in a key that causes the same "fingering" (gestures) to be used for all instruments (Bb trumpet, C trumpet, F trumpet) but when you play the note that looks like "C" you may be doing the "C-gesture" but that is not the pitch you are producing.  Here too the notes give you a gesture that has nothing to do with the pitch. 

 I can't see why Scordatura got invented for violin, however.  Was it just a fashion whimsy of the time, or is there a reason?  For example, I could see sound qualities being changed.  For example, we get sympathetic resonance (ring tone) across strings, and this would be changed by changed tuning.

Frieda
Posted: March 9, 2018
Iím going to try it this weekend. These sonataís sound really beautiful...

Elke Meier
Posted: March 8, 2018
At least the opening chord would be a nice D-major chord with this kind of tuning and playing it as if it hadn't been tuned differently :) - that should sound like D, F#, A, and D. Puh, I would be so confused :) :) 

Frieda
Posted: March 8, 2018
Iíll see my teacher on saturday, the 17th. Iím really curious about it... 

Dianne
Posted: March 8, 2018
So this would be in the key of  'D'?

Beth Blackerby
Posted: March 8, 2018
So cool. I've never played any of these sonatas. I can imagine what it does to the brain to see one thing and here something quite different than what your eyes are telling you it should sound like!

Frieda
Posted: March 8, 2018
Ha, sorry, thank you BjÝrn!

Frieda
Posted: March 8, 2018
Hi all, I donít now much about scordatura either; my teacher gave me the sheet music of Biber and I started to search performances of this sonate. But I immediately had so much questions... anyway... thanks all and also thank you Alan for the link, really appreciated!!!

Elke Meier
Posted: March 8, 2018
Thank you so much, BjÝrn, that was really interesting. He explained it so well! Even someone who heard the word for the first time in this thread could understand it :)!

BjÝrn Larsen
Posted: March 8, 2018
There is an explanation on YouTube:

BjÝrn

Elizabeth
Posted: March 8, 2018
It looks like Scordatura to me, but I donít know much about it unfortunately. 

Dianne
Posted: March 8, 2018
Hi, Are you using scordatura tuning?

I found this link. These are beautiful.

Frieda
Posted: March 8, 2018
Beth, so I play it all in C major...
It is the Himmelfahrt Mariae/ Sonate XIV of Biber.
Thanks!

Beth Blackerby
Posted: March 7, 2018
I've never, ever seen anything like this before. It looks like a very unorthodox way to indicate a modulation. Without knowing the piece I think you're supposed to interpret this as a modulation to C major. So the naturals are there to cancel out the key of A major. The notes in the chord and following arpeggio do suggest C major.

Frieda
Posted: March 7, 2018
Hi Elke, Beth and Dianne,
I have no problem with playing the chord with the open strings A and E or with the bowing but indeed Dianne... my question is about the three sharps and the there naturals on the same place? I mean, when I see a F sharp written right after the clef I play ALL the Fís sharp in every octave, except of course when there is a natural marked on my way. But in this case I see a F sharp, a C sharp and a A sharp AND a F natural, a C natural and a A natural? Iíve never seen anything like that.
I also see a bar between the clef and the accidentals... I think that means nothing special but normally it isnít there. 


Dianne
Posted: March 7, 2018
Frieda, do you mean the accidental on the C on the chord?

Beth Blackerby
Posted: March 7, 2018
Frieda, in terms of fingerings, Elke's first suggestion is really the only one that works. But if you're wondering how to play them from the standpoint of the right hand,  I do have those video in case you missed it.

Elke Meier
Posted: March 7, 2018
Frieda, take this with a grain of salt, it is PURELY theoretical as I would not attempt to play this... But IF I did I would probably do it in first position:
3r finger C#
1st finger E
open A 
open E

But what if you don't like to do it on the open strings in the chord? I had a look in my fingering chart where these notes could also be found on the four strings and found it in I think seventh position:
4th finger C#
2nd finger E
1st finger A
1st finger E

Haha, nice try... it dawned on me then that these would be all a whole octave higher - apart from the fact that with this kind of fingering my fingers would fall straight off... :)

But maybe this is completely different. One can never play four strings at the same time, so these cords always end up a bit like arpeggios. Then one could try it only on the three lower strings:
third position: 1st finger C#, followed by 3rd finger E, both on the G-string, followed by the 2nd finger A and E on the D- and A-strings. That would then really be a half arpeggio. 
Or starting in first position 3rd finger C# plus 1st finger E, then shift up to second position and cover A and E with the third finger on the D- and A-string. That one could theoretically be two double stops over each other. How one could do that though - don't ask me! This is purely theoretical musing...